Does a sub have a hope of disciplining high school students?

Should have asked sooner, but I am subbing in h.s. Language Arts tomorrow, and I've taught that teacher's classes once before. The 9th grade honors classes are well behaved, but some of the senior boys in the other classes get pretty rowdy. Nothing physical, just suggestive talk and stuff like that. My 12th grade daughter says they act the same way in every class, not just when there's a sub, but I feel like I shouldn't let them get away with that. I also worry that if I put my foot down, they will get worse, to see how far they can push me. Should I ignore them or send them to the principal or what? Last time I just made extensive notes for the teacher, figuring she could chastise them when she got back. Please give your advice. Thanks.

It really depends on administration. If they are weak sending them to the office, will only make matters worse.

I would suggest trying to work it out with the kids. "Hey listen, I'm only here for the day. How about we try to get along and do what your teacher asked.?"

Reasoning with kids and letting them know that understand how they feel, goes a long way.

Yeah, I usually try a casual approach first, like the one you suggested. Thank goodness, the worst troublemakers were all absent Friday - how could I get so lucky? One was being sworn-in to the Air Force, so his twin brother was also gone, to attend the ceremony. I hope the Air Force will straighten him up a bit, but of course, he still has to finish high school first, so his teachers will have to put up with him for several more months, poor things.

Also, the teacher left them some substantial work this time instead of just journal writing. No one cared to write in their journals last time.

[Caryn]

Hello, I am a high school business teacher but I have also had experience with substitution. Only recently, this past year, I have been a sub for three different high schools. The regular classroom teacher should have lesson plans made in advance (good teacher does), have an emergency folder (backup) for emergency leaves, and have a list of students with "write-ups" already for the sub for the students that misbehave on regular basis...Upon entering classroom, let students know that you have in hand, "Forms" already made out to turn in at the end of day to Principal! (But state you would rather throw them in trash)! Principals don't like to have subs bringing down students, nor their regular teachers, if a teacher can't handle her students, she/he shouldn't be there. This has always worked for my subs and students.
BE Tough!.....as students get to know you,,, they learn who they can push around when teacher is gone!....Caryn

First of all, let me say you are not alone. Students often view subs as a chance to 'try to get away with things', but try to remember they are just teens trying to test the waters and seeing what they can get away with. More importantly you have one day with them, so I agree that it is probably best to let the teacher handle the discipline the next day. However, the way that I begin a class when I sub is by introducing myself, telling them MY set of class rules: Which are very simple: Respect yourself and respect others, make an honest effort and ask questions. I then take 2 minutes to discuss with their input what respect means...what it looks like. This of course, does not always work, but it sets a tone and I know they are clear upfront with what I expect from them. I also have to overlook some smaller comments...I am afterall, only a sub for a day. I pick and choose my battles and pick and choose what i decide to report to the regular teacher...especially because I would like to be called back and no one likes to come back after a day off and have a zillion and one comments about their students to deal with.

you have already received great advice. I would add that if it is a school you work in frequently, you might want to introduce yourself to the principal and ask how he/she would like you to handle discipline when you are working in his/her building. I see it as a proactive step. Many schools have a sub handbook and/or training-our little school does not, but our teachers check in with subs in neighboring classrooms during the day to see how things are going. Good luck and thanks for being willing to sub.

My first thoughts also were meeting with the principal or department chair ahead of time and asking how you should proceed and what to do if this happens again. Since you have subbed this teacher's classes before, you have a more legitimate reason for asking about their policies on discipline. What these students are doing promotes a sexually harassing environment. Other students may be very uncomfortable and could potentially complain to their parents or administration and have a right to do so. It would be your job and responsibility to do something about it when it happens. If you are asking administration ahead of time, they can and should advise.

Thanks for the advice so far.

Originally Posted by Caryn

The regular classroom teacher should have lesson plans made in advance (good teacher does), have an emergency folder (backup) for emergency leaves, and have a list of students with "write-ups" already for the sub for the students that misbehave on regular basis...Caryn

Yes, the teacher knew ahead of time that she would be out and she left plans, but it was not enough to keep the kids busy. Four of the classes were to work on laptop computers, but she didn't arrange to have the cabinet unlocked, so the students were unable to use them. I wrote passes for several to go to the library and use the computers there.

When I sub in the elementary, I keep some word games and things on hand, and small prizes like mini shape erasers or stickers, but that won't work with high schoolers. Does anyone have any ideas for simple things to keep the bigger kids occupied?

Hi. I too am a sub for both Middle & High School, and have experienced some of the more lively and challenging high schoolers. As a soltuion to those issues, I use the following techniques which works most of the time:

First I ask them nicely to adhere to my request: "John please refrain from making comments like you just did".....

Second: I state my expectations: "John, you are expected to follow my directive to you when I give it"

Third: I state the consequence: " John, you don't have to follow my directive, but you do understand that if you don't you behavior will be disruptive and disrespectful to me, and detention or other disciplinary action will be taken"

Last: " John, you have a decision to make, you can follow my directive now, and we can continue eithout any further class interruption, or you will have detention, what do you plan to do ?"

While ti's not full proof, it does usually work, or the student faces the consequences stated.

As a classroom teacher of many years, who has been recently just sub-ing. I first must say my hats-off to all subs. It is a much harder job than I ever expected. It also gives you a different perspective on a school. I see how the school as a whole functions, how one area is related to another. And how the discipline over the entire school is handled. If schools were really progressive they would put their new administrators through a "sub" trial before putting them to work. This would be a great lesson in education. They would get a "feel" for the trials new teachers are going through, and the experienced ones as well. Each class is different and the dynamics of the entire class may hinge on one student being present or absent. They really do "gang" up on you. If this happens, and reason does not work, you must begin removing the ring-leaders. Letting them them have their "say", only fuels the fire. I find that many classroom teachers either ignore the notes/referrals I leave them, or throw the "busy" work away. I will not sub for them again if this happens and I find out about it. These children have to be held accountable, more so for a sub. The teacher should understand that it is a reflection of their class character and control. So I have started giving them (referrals) to the principal or administrator in charge, then follow up on it later. Once you have a reputation for follow through it will get around. (it only took 1 month in a school of 3000).
Once again, thanks to the "subs" of the world. Without them a classroom teacher would have a much different class to come back to (and life would be harder for the others who have to "cover" the classes w/ no subs).