Saxon versus Everyday Math

[wrong way fish]

I am looking for information on the differences between the Saxon and Everyday math curriculum. I have found many conflicting reports as to the most effective one to use. I have also found conflicting reports about which type of student (regular VS. Special Ed.) either is best used for.

Does anyone have any tips for a child who is proficient in Saxon (in Sped), however is struggling with Everyday (in reg ed) ? This child is at about a 2nd grade level, and has high function autism. He is bright and capable of the work, however frustrates easily with Everyday. Any advice would be helpful
Thank you in advance.

[Unregistered]

Ughhh.... Everyday Math is horrible. When I taught it around 70-80% of the lessons were above grade level. Aiming high works well with language arts, but with math kids need a foundation before they can apply the concepts in an abstract way.

Unfortunately, schools that use EDM also have math police. Their job:seek and destroy any effective math lessons and replace them with poems about fractals.

When I taught inclusion (75% of the class was sped) the kids developed math-anxiety. The thing is, as a teacher I know that there is no reason why 9 year olds should should have to solve algebraic equations involving negative numbers to the 1,000th power. So, when I'd see that we were doing a completely innapropriate lesson, I'd tell the kids, "Don't worry, you don't have to learn this, its on the _____ level. Just do your best, follow along, and fill in the work book pages." The kids would loosen up and more of the kids actually seemed to get the concepts.

I think that EDM tends to be adopted because it is marketed as being "higher level". Pity there is a difference between higher level and developmentally innapropriate. If the program isn't heavily (and secrectivly, thanks to the math police) supported by other materials then standardized test scores will plummet.

Anyways, hope this helps, letting the kids no that they are fine and the problem is with the curriculum worked for me.

[wrong way fish]

Everything helps! He tends to just put his head down and close it all out when he gets frustrated, or tell his para he needs a break...that's when he can, other times he tantrums when he doesn't "get" it.
I like the idea of being reassuring, I think that would work with this little guy.
If you don't mind...what were some of the supplementsl materials you used. I ask because it is this child's parents I am working with (I work with parenting skills for a family support program), and they would like to work with him at home also.
Thank you for your help!

[Unregistered]

I pulled from a lot of different sources. Basically, I would focus on a skill I wanted the kids to have and the structure mini-lessons (20 min) into the day. Schools that use EDM can get a bit gestapo-ish, often admin will blame the programs failure on teachers not "buying into" it, so you have to be quick when you teach age appropriate math.

My own personal theory is that there are four basic indicators of success for elementary math students: place value, computation, problem solving, and math vocabulary. I've noticed that when kids are doing well in those four areas they tend to learn new concepts with ease.

This may not be true for the child you are working with, but most of the autistic children I have taught have difficulty memorizing-which manifests itself as a computation and vocabulary problem. Of the two, parents would probably have an easier time helping him with computation.

This varies a little by state but in second grade kids should be able to:

1. memorize addition and subtraction facts

2. add up to 3 digit numbers with regrouping

3. add multiple 2 digit numbers with regrouping

4. subtract 3 digit numbers with borrowing

5. add and subtract numbers that contain decimals to the hundredths place

In third grade they need to be able to memorize multiplacation fact and understand how to use those facts to solve simple division problems.

The parents can make up problems themselves or they can use a worksheet generator from the internet (I like Dad's worksheets because it is easier to show parents the progression of computation skills across grade levels). If he gets frusteratedeasily then the parents could cut the worksheet apart so it is not as overwhelming.

EDM uses a "new" approach to computation-but every highschool math teacher that I have talked to says that the new approach makes math more difficult for them later on. In the long run I think kids are better off with the "old" method, but you might check and see how computation is taught in the local secondary school. If they ditch the EDM approach then you will be better off using the approach that has been effectively used for the last thousand years.

I realize on a bit of a soap box, but "new" math reminds me of districts that insist on teaching the dinealan handwritting method in primary, so that it will be easier to learn cursive in upper elementary. The punch line is that too many upper elementary classrooms don't teach cursive anymore. IMO there is not enough effective communication between schools in the same district.

[annettemcd]

I sometimes seem to be one of the few supporters of Saxon, but most of my experience is with the higher level materials: 65 and above. Both of my children went through Advanced Math and my daughter got 1/3 the way through the Calculus book.

I like the way that Saxon explains everything in the student textbook, so, if appropriate a student can work on his/her own even if the teacher is weak in higher math. It works well for students who are home-schooled. Saxon never lets a student discard a concept. Something covered in Lesson #1 can show up on a test after Lesson #35. The homework with each lesson may include material from any previous lesson in the book.

The disadvantage of Saxon is that it does not separate material into Algebra, Geometry, Trigonometry, etc. Everything is mixed together which is fine, but it makes it difficult for a student to start and/or stop using Saxon and switch into or out of a different series.

If a student sticks with Saxon from 5 through 12 grade, I think that they get a good Math education. I do not have enough experience with elementary level Saxon to have an opinion, though I do know that it is designed for home schooling and may rub a strong teacher the wrong way.

Oh, a final note, my daughter found that she had to study the way questions were worded on the SAT exams by taking practice tests because she found that though she knew the material, she got confused by the wording of the problems on the SAT as different from Saxon.

[Unregistered]

Saxon Math: It's an okay program. It is effective because it introduces new ideas in small chunks and provides a lot of follow up practice. The biggest draw-back to this program is that it skips around too much. Students rarely become excited about a math concept when they know that they will be off on another tangent the next day.

This program can produce an adequte math education, but not a great one. This is acceptable because few people need more than an adequate education.

EDM: This is a horrible program. It is developmentally innapropriate. The top 10% of students do well and the other 90% of students are chronically confused. This program appears to have been created on the premise that highschool math should be taught in elementary school, and elementary math should be skipped entirely. If anyone can explain why ten year olds need to be able to solve algebraic equations involving negative numbers calculated to the 10,000 power, but don't need to learn how to multiply, then I would love to hear that explanation.

[shubh]

Everyday Math teaches students to think mathematically, but for
students who need concrete examples and more repetition with
skills (such as students with special needs), Saxon would be your
better choice. Everyday Math is an excellent program, but it is confusing and
confounding for many parents. If students don't start in the
program, it is almost impossible to "catch up."